Gonella informed him about changes in protocol that were going to be made.
Carbon Date the Shroud Again? | Shroud of Turin Blog
The ground had shifted. As he later noted: This was in sharp contrast to seven labs testing samples taken from several different strategically selected areas Even more disappointing from my point of view was the absence of anything binding on the labs to coordinate publication. Father Rinaldi was shattered. Hi John This is very good information, however it is a bit different from what I was given to understand by an authority in Rome. Professor Luigi Gonella did not seem to be pro-authenticity, but was Professor Carlos Chagas responsible for the decision?
I did watch a minute TV report the day he died, where he said that he did not believe that the Shroud was authentic. How could Professor Chagas trample on the protocols he himself prepared? This matter needs further explanation.
Who was dictating the terms in the game and what kind of game was it? You venture into the corridors of Vatican intrigue at your own risk. Also, that he was anti-authenticity is from my sources well known. This has all been pretty much documented particularly by Gove.
The three labs that were allowed by the Vatican were to be chosen by Turin. Gove paid a price becasue his lab was not one of the three. I think that Gonella may have had a hand in that. Cardinal Ballestrero made it quite clear that his hands had been tied by the Vatican.
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It clearly was not what he wanted. Making Gove pay for his arrogance was a small bit of recompense. Thanks for the link, John. I know what can sometimes go on in Rome. Human nature is complex, but US ambassador Frank Shakespeare did not loose his faith! After all, the problem is there in other places too. Now what surprises me is that Ian Wilson — of all people! Curiously, Daniel Raffard de Brienne was hesitant to attack Gonella when I queried him, but that was because he found him to be very friendly.
I am not sure anyone or thing was behind Chagas except arrogance and touch of anti Americanism. The man is dead. On the other hand, the carbon dating of the Shroud was the beginning of billion dollar enterprise because the labs wanted a test case to show what they can do. STURP was on its own. Money flows to power and power flows to money. You also bandied around suggestions that my research was heading towards a dead end through failure to factor in a supernatural event understandably omitting to state how that could be tested, apart from an appreciative word for Paolo and his laser beams.
If you want to see progress — real progress — with no dead ends in sight, not yet at any rate, I suggest you check out the latest posting on my site.
Referencing your effort, obviously, only the top fibrils of the linen were scorched colored , since you repeated the process on the back of the cloth? The use of convoluted prose is a feature common to the Holy See and this is not just incidental as you wrongly imply. You should immediately inform the Radiocarbon experts who dated the old cloth about this. Lab archaeology is one thing. BOTH are needed in determination of reliable dates. In , lab archaeology ONLY prevailed at the expense of a multidisciplinary approach. Mordant is known to be used for intensifying stains e.
Now it is well known gelatine is a breakdown product of collagen. It has nothing to do with a supernatural event.
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- Radiocarbon Dating of the Shroud of Turin?
By replacing my myrrhic? How many postings on your own site? Or are we supposed to access your canon here how do we do that Dan? My latest model evolves as we speak.
The Shroud of Turin: Facts and Fiction
Nuff said for now methinks. The immediate problem is not a dead end thanks, JoeM but deciding upon which of numerous directions to proceed. I also need a break 2 months of non-stop experimentation. Have they not heard of Geber and his extensive writings, including a recipe for generating what we would now call nitric acid fumes beware: BTW how come you can totally rule out the possibility for the linen cloth to be genuine? Are you just aware the removal of such contaminants is either impossible or almost impossible? Were you a REAL scientist and not an agenda-driven scientist alike Hall et al from sad memory , your motto should be: This is getting somewhat tedious Max.
Last June, I was toying with the idea that quicklime, more specifically its heat of reaction with water — might have been used to produce a thermal image.
The grounds were tenuous to say the least. Quicklime forms an alkali with water calcium hydroxide which was incidental in my model. But I never implicated either limestone nor ammonia, and in any case dropped the quicklime idea in short order, finding experimentally there was insufficient heat to raise a template to scorching temperature. You on the other hand do not experiment, so consequently your ideas do not evolve. You continue to incant the same 1st century tomb scenario month after month, year after year, and continually scan my new thinking for evidence of plagiarism.
I am flattered that you dropped all your previous ideas and should want to finally take into account my fumigation theory as the most likely while recycling it to meet your anti-authenticist agenda. What you fail to take on board is it took me nearly 30 years to really think my fumigation theory does hold water. There I was thinking the art of delivering an honest-to-goodness diatribe was dead, and you immediately go and excel yourself. As for me, I have to be content with finding more mundane ways of filling my day, like turning out more images using my, sorry, your new nitric acid fumigation technique.
Radiocarbon Dating of the Shroud of Turin
One can imprint off a real person or statue, bas relief etc. The imprinting medium flour paste etc is non-injurious to skin. One can mould the linen to contours manually if desired, capturing as much or as little of the 3D relief as one wishes with more or less risk of lateral distortion. Development of the image in the fumigation chamber can be monitored visually at intervals over minutes or hours until one has obtained optimum image intensity, and the least damage to linen fibres. Retained acid fumes after development can be neutralized, either with lime water, or by dry dusting with powdered chalk.
However, some weakening of fibres must be expected. The technique allows for blood or blood substitute to be applied at the same time as body-imprinting medium, provided the blood or substitute stays red in nitric acid fumes real blood does not — it quickly turns a brown colour.
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Blood would have been applied after. When applied to new linen, the technique has a side-effect that would be seen as a bonus — artificial ageing of the linen. Centuries later, pro-authenticity chemists and others would be delighted to find there was less potential vanillin and more mechanical weakness than would be expected of medieval linen a mere years old. Chemical action of limited duration may result in more superficial change to linen fibres than is possible by thermal scorching, such that one sees no colouring at the interface of the SCW and central lumen.
Reverse-side coloration can be minimized by suitable adaption of technique thick linen, use of sizes to block up pores, use of viscous imprinting media etc. As properly noted, all this is simply an hypothesis at this stage, one that will need a lot of experimental work to evaluate, with the possibility of premature paradigm death at any stage.
However, I shall be taking a break from experimental work for at least a fortnight probably longer, these last few weeks having been fairly hectic, spent in and out of the garage, trying to avoid or escape acid spillage and acid fumes, first with the H2SO4, and now with HNO3 Phase 1 complete. This should explain point 1 and the lack of color in the SCW. Now, looking at your preliminary experiments http: Your hand image has sharp contours and consists of brown contact stains with many white no contact stains within it. This is not at all what we see on the Shroud. The latter is then converted to the image that existed on the TS when first produced the nature of which we can only guess at.
That second stage is probably one of chemical OR thermal development the latter as per Garlaschelli. After sleeping on that list of 10 points, all I would add for now is a gift wrapper in dubious good taste thinking of the sensibilities that prevail generally on this site, with one or two notable exceptions.
It was intended to be a bigger and better whole-body, front and back negative imprint NOT painting that would trump the Veil of Veronica, then the major draw for medieval pilgrims according to Neil McGregor, recently retired Director of the British Museum. No, they did not scorch the body image with a heated template, not if the aim was to simulate an ancient sweat imprint.